Sold as A Aulonocara Sp. Caroline Swallowtail

Looks like a Aulonocara Jacobfreibergi Otter Point to me.
What do you think?

Looks like Aulonocara Jacobfreibergi "Otter Point" to me. The best ones i´ve seen have alot of yellow on the body and dorsal fin. Maybe because of line breeding? Like this one.

http://www.ciklider.se/malawi/aulonocara_jacobfreibergi.shtml

Very interesting. I referred to Ads picture in his 4th edition of Malawi Cichlids in their Natural Habitat. (Man I love this book.) The A. Jacobfreibergi he has pictured is very close to both the Swallowtail and the line-bred species. The biggest difference being the lack of bright red in the dorsal and anal fins. Whether this has something to do with diet or maturity i can't say except that the line-bred fish seems to have more to do with the breeders preference then maintaining wild coloring.

I agree with you about the book "Malawi Cichlids in their Natural Habitat". The perfect book if one wants to identify the location of a species for instance. I have several books but this is by far the best one.

Maybe because of line breeding? Like this one.

There are a few nice "Swallow tails" and its the location that they come from that determines their coloration.
Of coarse there are line bred varieties,but it would make no sense to line breed a fish from one location to look like it was from another.
You might have to go farther back in the literature to find out about this fish known as a "Carolina Swallowtail",which is from a different location than Otter Point. A quick "google" of images shows a lot of color diversity and there are even fish listed there that are NOT Otter Point varieties.
Your fish probably comes from decendants of the Zimbawe Rock,Domwe Island location, where I have personally observed this type of coloration.
As I said there are a lot of "Swallow tail" Aulonocara most of which have been re-designated as Aulonocara Jacobfeibergi. Below is another "Swallow Tail" from yet another location.

Aulonocara jacobfreibergi "tsano rock"


Cheers,Larry

Now where have I seen that picture before?

Amazing that what some people try to come up with by line breeding can already be found in Lake Malawi such as your example of A. jacobfreibergi "tsano rock". It makes it all so confusing for those of us that wish to have something we think is associated with their counterparts in the wild.

It makes it all so confusing for those of us that wish to have something we think is associated with their counterparts in the wild.

Exactly, and i love to help you all out,,,I like the previous threads on "How they love Konings books!", this is the power of a well informed Cichlid Enthusiast.
I know the literature part can be like watching grass grow,,,but if you have been there it makes it more pleasurable to read,,,ya honestly
Going straight to the book to find out is so much easier and accurate than googling the web,,,you get the right answer,,,if the right fish is pictured!

I would point out that all of us when we start breeding our fish, we would all raise and use our best looking males,,,this in-itself is line breeding and there are many breeders taking their choices and breeding the fish for more color or certain colors,,,which makes breeding fish more fun.
I would point out at this time I am not a fan of cross-bred fish.

I think the fish pictured will be a nice fish when it gets up to the 4 inch size, he's looking pretty good now!

Cheers,Larry

Thanks for all the information.
Kind of a mute point now. It was with a male bi-color 500, and what was supposed to a male Lwanda. The bi-colored paired with the female lwanda and killed him.
I am just a little unhappy right now.
Ordered
1-neon blue chiwindi
1-caroline swallow tail
1-yellow collar
1-red top lwanda
1-eureka red
All males
Got
2-bi-color 500 males
1- female lwanda
1-Eureka Red not sure if male or female
1-Swallowtail.

At best it is going to be 2 out of 5 fish that are right.
Right now my money is 1 out of 5.
It was killed due to getting a female that was supposed to be a male.
Very poor business.

Sorry to hear that Roger. I hope whoever you ordered from tries to make things right for you. I still feel irked when I think about my so-called Red Empresses. I'm stuck with those and can't get pure ones now.

Betty, sure you can, Hun.
When warm weather gets here, I should have plenty.
Super Red Empress. I am going to undertake shipping some fish.

The people I got these from will not even reply to me.

I would try to let them make it right,if they don not, then we would ALL like to know who you got them from,,,let the rest of your "buds" here know here!
Put it in words here and Google will certainly broadcast it for you!
You do not have to bad mouth them or nothing nasty, just the facts,,,clearly, anyone who does any checking on the person, friend, or bussiness should do a search before buying over the internet!

Thanks,Larry

Thank You Larry,

That's exactly what I will do. It is great to have your input here.
I have contacted them 3 times with no response.

Larry Johnson wrote:I would try to let them make it right,if they don not, then we would ALL like to know who you got them from,,,let the rest of your "buds" here know here!
Put it in words here and Google will certainly broadcast it for you!
You do not have to bad mouth them or nothing nasty, just the facts,,,clearly, anyone who does any checking on the person, friend, or bussiness should do a search before buying over the internet!

Thanks,Larry

I agree with this 100%

Negative feedback is every bit important as Positive feedback (maybe even more important). So long as it is written up just like Larry suggested, I personally have no problem with it and I don't think the team here would either. I know I'd like to know who they are... might even send em a nasty gram on your behalf (course that would be private)

Sorry to hear again Roger..

Well They gave me a complete refund on all the fish.

They apologized and said, it was due to dealing with a new farm. They admitted they got fish that were wrong, and some that were colored up.

They have taken care of the problem, and will not have the problem again..
I will not post the company's name unless you want to know.

glad they took care of it for you Roger, i just wish they would not send "replacement" fish just because they dont have what you order in stock, that has happened to me a few times on different sites, including the site where Rogers fish came from

Well I'm glad they looked after you,hope you can get what you wanted in the first place!
Farms often substitute fish and your supplier has no control over that,however if they had notified you and advised of their substitutes they would have been the farther ahead.
I have heard of this happening occassionaly though.

Cheers,Larry

Great to hear that Roger. I hope you'll have the ones you wanted real soon.

- jay

i also bought a few fish known has swallowtails and i thought they looked like a jake but the one thing i find different with the one pictured here and the ones i have is that they have egg spots and none of my otter point jakes or my lemon jake have egg spots so i dont know if this is some kind of a hybred or what.

I'm gald this topic came up. What I thought was a Chipokae, looks more like a Johanni (but...not...quite...) but the tail fin doesn't look quite right, and the color pattern doesn't seem right... I'm beginning to doubt that my rocks are rocks, and my caves may be clouds as far as I know... (where is the 'sarcasm' button?)

What I was led to believe was a Rusty, isn't... Same goes for the Livingstoni... It is a Venusturus (splng?). Quite the learning curve being new to Cichlids... The people of this site provide the only credible information that I have gotten so far (thanks all!)

I know my Red Zebra is a Red Zebra (hoping), and I'm SURE of my Acei, but other than that, I have NO idea what else is in my tank! It would be nice so I know exactly how to care for them!

Can anyone suggest any reference material so I can figure out EXACTLY what I bought vs what I received?

I will post pics soon, hopefully you all can help me once again

cichlid forum has the best profile section on cichlids i have ever seen i use it all the time.

just check out the jake from tsano rock i sure hope that the fish i have, thats one sweet fish almost has cool as the otter point.

here is my swallowtail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGg6KP8NZLY